Another keg furnace

Joe, If the budget is thin, stick to a conventional build. A lift off tank can be done, but will require 10 times the fabrication that a simple hinge would take. I don't know your welding setup, but if you want to weld this thing together, you'll need to reconsider your choice of tank. Stainless suxs to work with in my opinion and you won't gain any added advantage by making it out of that keg. Mild steel is so much easier to work. I found a junk steel air compressor for 10bucks and whipped out the mig welder. My next rig will be more complicated for sure, but that will come in time. Not needed at the moment. A lot of guys do either no hinge and just pick the lid up and off... and others here do a lift and swing outta the way. Being able to move the lid with one hand is handy. Kelly does it with one finger. I opted for a typical hinge positioned about 3inches away from the furnace. When I open the lid, I don't get blasted by heat because I'm behind it. The no hinge at all works, but once you lift it off, ya gotta do something with that heavy hot beast!

 

Thank you Jason and Kelly for the replies.
I must say Kelly, that furnace and your build quality is approaching art! Your shop capabilities vastly exceed that of my own. While I am very proud of my shop. The machines are well kept and properly working but old. The machinist of WW2 would be completely at home with the equipment. Some dating to as far back as the civil war. The only thing digital is a calculator and a cell phone.

The fabrication work would not be a problem if it proves out to be worth it. The material cost will be kept at a minimum due to having scrap and some material on hand. The welding end of the shop is a week link at this time. My TIG welder is down and most likely need to be replaced rather than repaired. That only leavs the stick welder. At one time I was a functional welder but I have not welded in several years. I do have friends and family that will do that part if I ask and do the prep work. I don’t dislike stainless but it is a lot more work than black steel. No mater if the shell is lifted ore not. The lid will be mounted on a horizontal lift pivot assembly that appears to be popular with this style furnace.

I have been very hesitant to begin as I am very much in the learning stage. At this time I am inclined to shy away from a overly complex design just because I am not quite sure of the sizing of the keg in reference to if it will fit the future needs of the shop. I think it will and with the liner and keg coming together as they did along with a distant memory of having a No. 10 crucible or two some wear in one of those boxes. It had to happen. If I was to do it from scratch. I would certainly use soft steel.

One other draw back is when I first started having health problems . I let my sone and his family live in the house with the shop while me and my wife moved into town for convenience.
Unfortunately this puts me 14 miles from my shop so I only make it out a 2-3 times a week for short visits.

I am off to the shop now. If there is any thing worth posting at the end of the day I will post some pictures.

 

I did make some progress although not a lot. I dug an old work cart I had built many years ago out of the scrap pile. It was bent with the remains of a motor stand on it and 2 good wheels. I removed the stand then cut it down to size, cut some .1 inch plate for a top 1/4 X 3 flat stock for the ends and hitch along with cutting the 1 inch pipe and a .850 torsion bar spring from a sprint car for the pivoting shaft.

The first picture is of the old cart with the stand attached and the keg sat on top. Just made me wonder. Could I just pick put the entire furnace on a pivot then pour through a funnel to direct the metal. Not any time in the near future future!
That is where the project is now.

Joe

 

that looks good... Pour through a funnel?? You'd be the first around here with a spinning furnace. The pro's have tilting furnaces and then there is the option of a cupola style where ya pull the plug and let the metal flow out the bottom. I suggest walking before running. This is an unforgiving hobby, stick to the normal setup until you build up your confidence... You can always build another furnace down the road.

Where is our eBay metal dealer with the tilting rig for melting cylinder heads?? That might be good for you to see. I can't remember his name.

 

NO! The tilting thing was just a passing thought. Not one that I would seriously consider on a hobby scale. I have seen a few of the tilt over scrap yard smelters, again not something of interest. This will not be my first furnace. I have a copy of The Charcoal Foundry 1983 printing that I bought in 83. Back then I built an electric along with a charcoal furnace and what was required for some aluminum casting in green sand.
It was fun and educational. I did make some useful items but never got as involved as I would have liked. Lets just say it was one of those operations were I am just glad there were no pictures or videos.

Joe

 

Aging is a royal pain.. First it's your eyes then it's your memory....

Found ya the video of Masteryoda. He's got a slick setup.

 

That is a very neat set up. I think his intention is more salvage than casting. It would be a great way to obtain large quantities of high quality aluminum for next to nothing. To be used later.

Joe

 

I did very little welding on my keg. Just some sheet metal around the tuyere to act as a clamp for my burner tube. Everything else was done with bolts and brackets.
I have a couple of crucible furnaces, one made from a keg and one made from a 5 gallon pail. The pail furnace has a lid that I just lift off and set on bricks. It isn't too heavy and I keep the hot side pointed away when I lift it off and set it on fire bricks. The keg lid is on a pivot like you're planning and works great. One thing I was careful about was the stability of the rig when pivoting the lid. The last thing I wanted was for my furnace and cart to fall over because of a top heavy lid! I tested and found the most favorable position for the pivot point before I secured the keg to the cart.

Pete

 

Thanks for the reply and advice on stability Pete. As is obvious from the pictures this project so far has been dictated by material on hand. The cart was built with the close spaced wheels to allow easy movement on small paths or walkways. It is not optimal for this project. It is what I had on hand at zero cost. As it appears now. There are two obvious solution. One would to be to weight the underside of the cart and place a leg in the center opposite the wheels for a 3 point ground contact. This I think would be the best method for a furnace where the crucible is lifted out the top. The other would be to put a piece of 3 foot channel iron across the end opposite the wheels with 1 fixed and 1 adjustable leg for a 4 point ground contact setup. This type of setup would be used if I decide to go with a 3 piece furnace where I lift the top and barrel together.

On further construction and decisions.
I clamp or bolt the bottom down. If I go with the 3 piece, lift top / barrel. These parts will both be built on a moving cage that is secured to the keg with strap clamps. I think this would be the best method to allow for later alterations. Again this will all be determined by materials on hand.
THIS IS THE QUESTION I WILL ASK OF EVERYONE ON THE FORUM.
To lift the barrel and lid together or just use lifting tongs? I am not getting any younger!
At this time I am giving great thought to this question. Kelly said he likes his lift off but along with others has warned of cost and complexity. In my situation the cost would be minimal. It does not appear to be that complex. Famous last words! The question becomes is it an asset in most situations? I do like the thought of a lift off furnace. I would gladly put in the extra effort if it is worthwhile to do so.

LETS TAKE A VOTE. YEA OR NAY?
on the lift off furnace.

Joe

 

Nay. Building lifting tongs is not child's play but you can certainly do it. Lifting the crucible out of the furnace is not as strenuous as pouring, and you're not going to escape that, so, avoid the complexity of the body lift.
Joe, I'm not sure if you checked out the link I posted in Post #2. It is a thread over at Alloy Avenue. It covers alot of the design topics you're considering.

Pete

 

I’m no expert, but I think if you work alone the lift furnace would have big advantages. If you are doing 2 man pours I would question all the extra effort.

I work by myself and built a single tool to lift and pour. It’s half ass at both and I struggle with 20lbs in the crucible. But it works.

 

I'll be your huckleberry... NO lift off, No lift up and out... How about a DOOR??? I still like this rig.

 

Thanks for the reply. Pete I did watch your video and decided a similar top pivot was the way to go. I am doing a lot of second guessing at this point in the hopes of building as safe and user friendly as I can. The fabrication part is not a problem however very slow. As of now the plan is to mount the bottom of the furnace on the stand (cart). A vertical frame mounted to the cart would be the lift for the top and barrel. If the lid and barrel are lifted together some forum of counter weight or mechanical advantage will be needed to counter the weight of the furnace. The lid,/ barrel if separate from the bottom would be attached to the lifting frame with strap clamps while the base of the furnace would be bolted to the cart coming down on alinement pins in the base. This would allow for easy disassemble and repair.

After looking at what others have built. This is what is rolling around. It still depend a lot on materials on hand. I did take a rough inventory when I was at the shop the other day. I think I have every thing needed for this part of the project.

I am also leaning in the direction of the 3 part furnace simply because if it would work out that a lift out style would work better in some applications. I can always us it as such.
The one Jason posted above looks very interesting. If I was starting from scratch. It would be one worth considering.

At some point a small chain hoist / gear box on an I beam carriage assembly might come into play for lifting and pouring but for now that is not in the plans.

Joe

 

What is the life span of the kaowoll/mesh type "furnace"?

5-10melts?

 

My Satanite coated wool furnace will be 4 years old this month and it still looks about the same as when it was finished. It's had around 200 crucibles of aluminum melted with propane. I really like this way of building a light weight furnace. I'm currently building an A10 size with the same materials. I have to be able to pick my furnaces up and move them, so this construction makes a very mobile furnace. Plus the build is a piece of cake, no forms to build, no complicated drying times, just paint the coating on the wool and fire up the burner. It's also an inexpensive way to build.

 

I heat ceramic shell to around 1700 right? Well, I use pieces of kaowool to pluck them outta the kiln and position them for pouring bronze. Even though it's rated for 2300, I can tell ya the stuff does catch on fire. Why it burns at lower that rated temps is beyond me. Direct contact? don't know... don't care. A box is cheaper than buying the right gloves and lasts forever!