A box of wax foxes

Discussion in 'Investment casting Ceramic shell method' started by Jason, Mar 16, 2018.

  1. Jason

    Jason Gold

    They were dried inside my house and we keep it between 73-75. I'm not molding these. Fritz already did the silicone mold. Worse case scenario, I'll send him the correct wax. When you lean fwd as far as I do, ya gotta know where to draw the line.
     
  2. Jason

    Jason Gold

    Art... yup on all accounts. I keep the slurry inside with all waxes. The silica lives in the garage.
     
  3. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Probably best to check with the artist on this one. Artists can get funny about duplicate moulds knocking around. Also if the original casts turn out or the artist runs some bronzes from the original mould and the new mould there will be a discrepancy in sizes in the final casts.
     
  4. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Agree, send hime some wax and let him do the work.
     
  5. Jason

    Jason Gold

    Good Point... If I make a mold of the wax foxes, the result will be smaller. I noticed a difference in the original rose I made and the run of 10. I didn't make a mold of the original one and pulled a plaster of the first bronze piece.

    It looks like I am able to save the cracked victim in the video. I did a real stupid one that I'll tell you guys.... I took the cracked victim and right into the slurry it went. (I forget it still had holes drilled in it! MAJOR WHOOPS!) :oops::oops::oops: So I took it straight outside to the garden hose and washed it inside and out. :D After it dried, I patched the holes and have been adding additional layers. Pilots are the worlds worst and best at compartmentalizing tasks. Total focus on the main task, save the piece and screw the rest.
     
  6. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    If its not the wax it could be the drying. This can be a little hard to explain this early in the morning pre-coffee but i'll give it a go.
    If you dip and silica and leave to dry the surface evaporates the moisture and the layers underneath are still damp. Eventually all the moisture evaporates and the wax is ready for another dip. If you dip again while the inner layer is still damp then the top layer will dry out and shrink while the inner layer still has moisture, causing shrinkage issues that cause cracking. This is common in cavities and i have had cracking and delamination due to this (when im impatient!)
     
  7. DavidF

    DavidF Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Dude, you can be my pilot any time the plane is going down :D
     
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  8. Jason

    Jason Gold

    I can see that happening easily. These had a solid DAY or more between dips. I was watching inside the cavity and it took forever to turn orange. See what I mean now? Craziest shit I've seen in my short time doing this.
     
  9. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Oh yeah, it also happens if your slurry is too thick as well. I know from experience when i thought i was being clever on a rush job. 3 thick layers is the same as 5 thin, right?
     
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  10. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Haha, ive done this too!!!! I didnt rinse it off tho, just called the artist and said there would be a delay while i went drinking!
     
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  11. Jason

    Jason Gold

    NOW you are onto something oh wise one. I have noticed it has been getting a little thick. I visited with Barry at outback foundry in Baton Rouge recently and noticed his suspendaslurry was thinner than mine. He told me to thin it with some distilled water. I did when I got home and did the last coat. I think we have a winner!

    I'm still at 6 total coats so I didnt short cut that one. But I like they way you are thinking!
     
  12. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Sounds like it could be it. What do i win? Forget it, it will be worth it if your rinsed mould comes out ok. Let me know if the finish is different on the 2 casts.
    Thick slurry has been a problem for me as ive never bothered with a zahn cup and just eyeball the viscosity before i dip. This is fine if im just dipping one or 2 waxes at a time but for more it can be a problem.
    The viscosity can look ok on the first of several items in a small batch of slurry but it can get quite thick after several waxes have been dipped. The water gets absorbed by previous dry slurry/silica coats, leaving the solids in the bucket.
     
  13. Jason

    Jason Gold

    You bet! I don't own a zahn cup either and R&R has an insane (to me anyways) method to measure viscosity. I just dewaxed the 2nd fox (yeah it's 1:30am here) and it looks like it came out great. No weird flames and no visible cracks. Doing this stuff is definitely more art than science. Fingers crossed!

    Btw, when do you throw out the rest of the bucket of slurry? 1/4? 1/3? I know you cant keep adding water forever???
     
  14. Zapins

    Zapins Gold

    yeah I didn't think about the issues of copying them and the artist. Makes sense though. Also mold making is expensive, probably easier to ship the artist the wax and make him copy them lol.

    Yeah man hollow castings suck. They take forever to dry inside. I found that out with my bull's and frogs. I've been considering a dehumidifier to help pull the moisture out of my molds. Better the aquarium bubbler trick.

    Yeah you definitely need to thin the slurry with distilled water from time to time. It gets way too thick as the dry shells suck out water. The shells are sucking the water component out of the mix not the binder so it doesn't dilute out the binder over time. That is why it -thickens- the slurry up lol.

    I never throw slurry away. Just mix up a new batch of slurry and add it to the old batch. That keeps it good.

    I haven't seen the need for a zahn cup. They are crazy expensive and either I haven't reached the levels of refinement and poise to notice the defects in my castings that improperly mixed slurry has or there just haven't been any major effects from eyeballing it but my castings seem to work out ok without zahn cups.
     
  15. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Yep, what he said!
     
  16. Jason

    Jason Gold

    The Foundry (aka my garage) is open! Everyone needs an old office chair on wheels in the garage.
    20180418_184433.jpg

    Microwave blower is perfect!
    20180418_200541.jpg

    20180418_194902.jpg

    The horse reign worked perfect! Those tiny bronze pieces are 1/8"
    I'm blown away they filled! The reign is that twisted looking thing in an "S" shape.
    20180418_224129.jpg

    Fox #1. This is the one that had a crack but DID NOT get dewaxed.
    I only added two more layers and crossed my fingers. Came out perfect.
    20180418_224140.jpg

    This is #2 that cracked during dewax. The cracks are actually hardly visible.
    Damn shame some asshat dipped it with the vent HOLES STILL OPEN! I believe that is what caused the issue seen here.
    It's still a keeper and can be easily reworked.

    20180418_224153.jpg
     
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  17. Artopsy

    Artopsy Copper

    Very nice job!
    I was confident with the reigns thing, thats why we use silly-bronze with shell moulds.
    Agreed about the "asshat" issue. Somebodys got a bit of filing to do!
    Overall i call it a success. Well done Jason.
     
  18. Tobho Mott

    Tobho Mott Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Nice saves!

    Jeff
     
  19. Jason

    Jason Gold

    Thanks Jeff. Would have gotten 2 good saves if I hadn't dumped a shell in the bucket that still had holes open on it. I've asked Fritz to send me another wax. #2 is more welding and sanding back and I think I'll lose the swirl action of the fox on my personal copy.

    I wanted a hint of high polish without the hours of labor. So I used LoS and left the recesses darker to maintain the swirl of this fibinachi numbering system that was the inspiration for Fritz.
    The high spots I buffed back with a scotchbrite and baking soda water to stop the patina. The last two photos are with it wearing it's wax coating. Hope they like it!

    Anyhow... ON WITH THE SHOW!
     

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  20. Zapins

    Zapins Gold

    Turned out well man. What do you have for a sand blaster? I need a proper blasting setup mine is pretty adhoc and low power. Makes a mess.
     

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