Another cement mixer muller

Discussion in 'Sand Mullers' started by Melterskelter, Mar 25, 2018.

  1. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    975D36B9-89F1-464C-BFDB-ECCD2F7B9524.jpeg 60355AFD-ADE5-4EEA-B11D-29E250117377.jpeg 32115715-CEE0-41C7-A063-85AAF6088551.jpeg 37E48BB3-AAE8-41F2-86BB-1DC99B85236F.jpeg 1606A3C6-78DB-457C-BCFF-63EADCD55E5D.jpeg Someone in another thread recently said they wanted to see pics or video of the muller I made last Fall. So here is a short video I made this afternoon. And also included are a few stills. The basic mixer is a vintage Lion I bought in Canada. It is pretty skookum with a cast iron ring gear and cast iron backbone. I seems to work quite well being happiest with about 2/3 of a five gallon bucket of sand. The plows were mounted so they can be easily adjusted and the cast iron wheel (started its life as a precision before I got it and modified it on my lathe) pulley rides up and down freely. It tips while running to allow dumping out mulled sand. Maybe I’ll upload a video of that later tonight.
     
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  2. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    Here is a video of the muller dumping sand. Right now I am dumping into a tray as it was available and is wide so it does a good job of catching the sand. Very soon I will be installing a conical chute that will direct the sand into a 5 gal bucket. But there are other more pressing issues like trying out my new steel flasks etc. Later will come the chute.

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    I am posting this pic to point out the extended handles on my muller. This thing weighs around 350 pounds, so lifting one end of it with the supplied short handles is a chore. The extended handles make a huge difference.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2018
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  3. Tobho Mott

    Tobho Mott Gold Banner Member

    Thanks, the close-ups of how you attached the upper parts to the stock mixer are much appreciated. I bought my cement mixer in Canada too. Looks like your muller works great & is really sturdy!

    Jeff
     
  4. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

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    Here are a few pics showing the attachment of the square tube that supports the wheel and plows. It took some “figurin” to get around the ring gear and pivots on the cast iron frame. But that frame provided a very solid base into which 3/8” bolts could be drilled and tapped so that the square tube could be held rigidly. Here are a few pics.

    The wheel support tube is free to rotate and slide up and down in the outer pipe attached to the overarm. I think the wheel weighs around 20 pounds and that weight seems to provide enough down-pressure for good mulling. A trailer hub and axle assembly provides a weldable axle, sealed bearing, nuts, and hub more than adequate for a wheel.

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  5. Tobho Mott

    Tobho Mott Gold Banner Member

    More awesomeness! Thanks again for sharing this, these pic will be super helpful when I get a little farther along in my own build.

    Jeff
     
  6. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    Is your mixer basically the same design as mine? Might be a different brand, but the same cast iron ring gear and cast iron mounting backbone for the tub?
     
  7. Tobho Mott

    Tobho Mott Gold Banner Member

    I think mine is a little different, it's the Princess Auto one. Here's a close-up of the gearing:

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    Jeff
     
  8. Thanks for the video and pictures. I've got almost the same mixer and have about decided to decimate it to make a muller. I haven't mixed concrete in years and just use sack mix for small quantities now anyway.
     
  9. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    It will make a fine muller. They are so robust that I am quite sure I will wear out long mine does. The cast iron frame provides a strong base to which you can attach plows and wheels etc.
     
  10. I have a few question:

    1 Seems like you put a lot of reinforcement around the rim. What was the reasoning?

    2 Any comment on the difference between rubber tires and iron tires?
     
  11. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    1). I reinforced the rim with a band of steel around the OUTSIDE and a short bit of the cone of the tub remained on the inside after I sliced off the cone with an angle grinder. The cone was sliced off while the drum was under power—-just braced against the frame and let the grinder make a partial cut all the way round and then continued letting it cut until finished. That made for a good flat cut. I tacked the remaining cone to the tub and tacked the band to the outside. This ensured the tub remained round and gave a somewhat broad smoothish rim that would not grab clothes or tend to cut skin. Might have got by with less, but what the heck. The cost of the band was negligible. Once everything was tacked, I again powered the tub and held the angle grinder to the rim as it rotated to smooth it out.

    2) I have no experience with rubber tire. I chose the iron wheel as I had the makings for it and it’s weight would provide good down pressure. I think a “slick” rubber tire with a spring for down pressure would work well. Providing for some freedom up and down and for rotation seems like a good idea. I think a person could fab a heavy steel wheel using a piece of pipe and could fill it with cement or lead or steel shot etc. Maybe use a forklift wheel etc....
     
  12. Thanks! I was not questioning the wisdom of the reinforced rim, just asking for the logic.

    I'm starting to wonder if it is necessary to put the flat bottom in the mixer. Mine has a fairly flat bottom anyway, and I've found an old iron pulley. Curved plows for sure, but would the wheel against the curved bottom promote mulling.

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    My concern is the wheel too wide for the mixer size?

    The mixer lost a bearing on a job, i had an identical one at home so I gave the guy mine and took his home. I've never repaired it but it's time.

    Am I asking too many questions?
     
  13. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    That mixer and wheel are just begging to become a muller.

    Best,
    Kelly
     
  14. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    My intuition is that your wheel needs to pretty well conform to the bottom. I notice mine smashes the sand flat to a thickness of about 3/8". I am told that smashing the sand is an important aspect of mulling but I know only what I've read My intuition is you should have a flat bottom in the muller as plows will be easier to make and adjust for angle and wheel contact is important. A very wide wheel will need more down pressure to do its job. I think I'd shop around.

    You get to question the wisdom of anything I suggest as I am only one muller ahead of you. I hope other folks with more experience will chime in. I'd ask a lot of questions so you have the best chance of avoiding false starts.

    Having a chain hoist set up and a lifting ring temporarily attached to the center of the plate made handling my 1/2" thick bottom plate a whole lot safer and easier. I think I had it in and out at least 6 times before it was bolted in place.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2018
  15. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Melterskelter is right....big footprint needs higher down force for same compaction pressure, but the foot print will be a function of both wheel diameter and width. Even so, too small of a diameter can tend to plow the sand instead of roll over it depending on sand depth and can limit the muller capacity and batch size. What is the diameter and width of the wheel?

    Best,
    Kelly
     
  16. The wheel above is 11-1/8" diameter and 5" wide.

    I have an old drill with press wheels which are 14" diameter x 1-7/8" wide.

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    I can make a wheel, it seems like maybe 8" diameter and 3" wide would be appropriate.
     
  17. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    Again, speaking from extremely limited experience I can say my cast iron wheel is 7.25" diameter and 4" wide and weighs right at 20 pounds. I was extremely lucky to have been given it a year ago though at the time I had no idea to what use it might be put. It seems very fine for my muller which has a 24" tub and probably would work in one down to 20 inches or so. I think if it were 8 inches that would be a nearly ideal size. A little heavier would be just fine. I would not want it any lighter. MullerWheelRaw (1).JPG MullerWheelRaw (2).JPG

    I have no idea what your machining experience might be with respect to the prospect of making a wheel. I think making a wheel would be a good option. But, plasma cutters have become so popular of late I would offer just one caution. Turning plasma-cut steel has been a bugger for me. Plasma cutting creates an extremely hard nitrided crust that is tough to deal with since carbide is easily destroyed by that crust. Flame or waterjet cutouts are great and with a little luck can be had for cheap as scrap. Anyway, forgive me for interjecting likely unneeded advice. But I have clear unpleasant memories of a job I had turning roughly plasma cut discs a couple years ago. It was a test of patience.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2018
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  18. Petee716

    Petee716 Gold Banner Member

    My wheel is about 3"x8" diameter. It's cast iron weighing about 20lbs. It looks like it's off an old warehouse flatbed cart. My muller is a rotating drum with fixed wheel and plows. I run my wheel as far as I can off-center of the drum's rotation to get as much skidding action as I can without stopping the wheel's rotation. Greensand is more forgiving in that regard than petrobond.

    Pete
     
  19. J.Vibert

    J.Vibert Silver

    My intent is to use two wheels that I think are identical in dimension to Pete's. Can't comment on how well they perform their function as of yet but I'm working on that...
     
  20. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Is skidding action preferred to rolling compaction?

    Best,
    Kelly
     

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