What year was this house built?? If its flexible conduit the wires are pulled through, its grounded through it, but you have 2 prong outlets. They've made it this long without burning down right???
FWIW, that would be enough to make me walk away. If that's to code, which would surprise me, it's only so because it's grandfathered in, it certainly would not meet code for new construction.
And what's the electrical situation in the garage in terms of the wiring from the house to the subpanel?. Is it in fact a sub panel or does the garage power come from the pole? I think code in this case just means you can sell the house. Lol. Sorry-not funny. I doubt the house is old enough for knob and tube so it's likely shielded cable. As long as there is continuity to ground on every single circuit it should be safe enough but the issue might be more about rated amperage of the circuits. We tend to draw more amps than we used to. If the service panel can be updated and all of the circuit terminals safely upgraded to 3 prong outlets (GFI as appropriate) as well as assurance of amperage capacity for items such as range, clothes dryer, air conditioner, etc then the cost for those upgrades should be deducted from the price or the owner gets it done. Under the supervision and advise of a licensed electrician of course. If it isn't done now, it will be done before you sell it yourself. Pete
Besides ancient wiring... Then comes the asbestos and lead paint concerns. Unless I was after an old special antique property, I'd avoid anything built prior to 1985. Fuses instead of circuit breakers is a deal breaker for me. No thanks! I've got a sister right now running around Tennessee trying to buy something with 45acres. Prices are STUPID! At the moment, they are entertaining a place built in 1960 for 350k. The house is 85k AT THE MOST (no dishwasher?? WTF?) so that makes the acreage pretty damn expensive! I posed these same questions to her... 2 hole plugs, lead paint and asbestos! But the house has new paint! Sure, then you try to sell it to people with a 3yr old that likes to chew on door jambs. But the house has new laminate floors..... Sure they went right over the old linoleum that contains asbestos. It's not really a problem until later when you try to sell or finally decide to deal with the abatement. Then comes BIG $$$$$. Newer than 1985 and you should be pretty damn safe. OH, I almost forgot, POPCORN CEILINGS!!! Old old popcorn is also an asbestos nightmare. Avoid popcorn like the friggen plague! My house (1988) had the shit and I've removed all of it. I didn't bother with the asbestos test because of the age.
My house is 98 yrs old. Have owned it for 20+ yrs. Think that it took about 10 yrs to update all the old cloth covered wiring. In my case, the pain and cost of that work was accounted for in purchase price. Most sane people don’t want this type of hassle. The old ass wiring will cost you money when you go to resell if you don’t fix it. I would make owner eat cost for upgrade or I’d be inclined to walk. That’s just me.
House was built in 1972. There is no popcorn ceiling and the insulation I saw in the walls and attic looks like yellow fiber glass insulation with the paper backing. Per the owner he has no knowledge of asbestos or lead paint. I did not pay extra for these tests as I figured it didn't seem likely to be there and would add extra time/delay/expense. Maybe a mistake? There are breakers no fuses. The main panel looked up to date/modern. There is a sub-panel in the garage and it draws power from the main panel not the pole. What is shielded cable? The outlets on the wall where you plug into are all 3 prong but per the home inspection none of the grounds appeared to be connected to a ground. I'm not sure what needs to be done to fix this. I had thought it meant running a ground wire to each plug to ground them all, but maybe I'm not right? Maybe I'm a bit naive but why do the walls need to come off to redo wiring? Why can't they take the plug face plate off the wall and push a ground cable down into the crawl space under the house (maybe 2-3 feet down) and run the cable to the breaker box to be grounded? I don't think I'll walk at this point I'd have nowhere to live and the rest of the issues in the house are minimal/small cosmetic issues no other major issues. Even if I have to repair the electrics I'm hoping it doesn't cost over 5-10,000? But then again I have no idea since I don't run cables and do wiring to know the costs involved. What do you think?
I would like to say this is a little bit harsh opinion on somebody else's opinion. Can you please explain? My first home was built in the late 50s (I think 59). It had the old black and green linoleum peel and stick tiles that had asbestos in them. They were hidden under the carpet. I never had them checked for asbestos, I asked my uncle to come over and take a look and he is a flooring installer and retailer for almost 50 years now. He said he was about 99% sure. He said for proper removal will probably cost me $5000ish. I tarpped off the hallway, sprayed them down with a little bit of water and slowly peeled them off with a shovel. There was about 50 tiles in all. $100 a piece for removal I couldn't swallow. I have a good face mask out of the deal. This same home also had only two blade plugs in all the bedrooms and in the family room. They did have two conductors and a ground wire running to each metal box. When I replaced all the outlets I had to add a ground wire to the receptacle as most of the ground wires were cut too short to extend out of the box 5 to 6 inches. That one outlet in the bathroom and the 3 outlets in the kitchen had ground prongs. Did your electrician do a quick visual or actually took the panel cover off and pulled the receptacles out of the boxes to see. I personally wouldn't buy a house unless I got a screaming deal that has: -Asbestos in it -Knob and tube wiring -Only two conductive wire wiring -Aluminum wiring
Someone just changed the plugs and didnt update the wiring. Hit them in the wallet big time for this! 10k minimum! Circuit breakers are a plus.. You will get to sign the lead based paint and asbestos disclosure paper work at closing. Then it becomes your problem. If your agent didnt inform you of any of this, they suck. To update and fix the wiring means the drywall has to come off. No other way to gain access and run new wires most likely. Ask David, he's well versed in going down to the studs to fix old wiring. As a busy young professional, dont get in too deep on a starter home. Save your energy and money for the forever house down the road. Then you can go balls out. Until then, pour bronze, chase tail, drink beer and pay your loans off.
In the early days it was acceptable to have the box grounded and the ground transferred through the receptacle screws. This is no longer the case. Now you have to have, if it is a metal box it grounded and the receptacle grounded as well, transferring to the ground pin. A lot of the code changed when plastic and aluminum boxes started coming out. As well, it was not considered a good ground transferring ground through the receptacle screws.
A lot of changes have been made under the electrical code in the past 20 years. Split circuit alternating was a big one. I like this one. Then the next thing was 15/20 amp 120v. I like this one too. Then there is the ground fault breaker's for wet areas. I like this one too. I have one of these powering my 60 amp rotary phase converter. Now on to the arc fault breakers? Depending on where you live and the electrical authority, these breakers are big bucks. But they have big returns. I am not sure if the returns are worth the dollars.
Doesn't hurt to raise this issue with seller's agent indicating that you want X dollars off price due to the wiring issue. Chances are that they already knew about it and very well might have lost one or more potential buyers because of it. They'll likely come back with some counter offer. Worst case, they decline to adjust price. If you have a decent buyer's agent, they should be able to assist you in making a convincing argument to seller. Best present topic in friendly, sympathetic manner. Something like, "I love the house. Sellers did a great job maintaining the place. However, I really need to update the electrical for reasons a, b, c. Our agreed upon price is at the very top of my price range, so I will not have the money to fix this. The amount I'm asking for won't cover the all additional cost, but will be enough to complete the bare minimum." Basically, be the "nice young man" who loves the seller's home, but needs a helping hand. If you don't mind being somewhat disingenuous, your story could be something like, "my Mom is going to be moving in with me, so I can take care of her. She just had a quadruple inferior lobe lung rescission. Her medical support machinery will require that I update the electrical."
PERFECT! I'm hiring you next time I buy a house. Sellers should be sympathetic to first time home buyers, but they usually just don't give a shit. Mine wasn't until I threatened to walk after getting jerked around over a garbage disposal! Somehow, they decided it wasn't worth trying to sue me and brought a $500 check made out to C A S H to the closing. I cashed that sucker right after I left! I did get them to cough up closing costs... Which is usually the expense for the seller in a normal world. I can't complain, the house has appreciated 80% in the last 10years. I'm okay with that. Just proves it's all about location, location, location.
Thats a big one...." aluminum wiring " If its aluminum wiring, I would walk. Could have difficulty with insurance. 2 conductor copper wiring in the black jacketing isn't a deal breaker. Seems odd for it to have circuit breakers and be an ungrounded system. Likely the panel was upgraded at some point in time. It should have a sticker inside the box of the electrican who did the upgrade. If it does not, then there was no permit issued and you have a bit of leverage on the seller. Sellers disclosing that they have no knowledge of lead and asbestos means just that. Its in your lap to find out if it does. You buy it you own it. Its a 50 year old home, not a brand new one!!
It was harsh, no doubt. But after all the moonshine I drank this weekend .....lol Its just that it is an older home and there are typical things that come with buying an older home that one needs to expect. People thought I was a crazy idiot for buying my old farm house, especially since everything in it was "not working" or " untested". But I knew what I was getting into, and although it took me a year to get it to where I wanted it I couldn't be happier. Especially since I can sell it for over 100k more than what I have invested, and potentially a lot more in the coming years since Fair hill has upgraded their facilities to 5 star status for horse racing. Thats what I had to do prior to selling my old house..
Shielded cable looks like what's in the picture. In older installations there are 2 wires inside which is most likely what you have. That coiled steel runs all the way, unbroken to the breaker panel. It terminates at the metal outlet box and acts as a ground. It is formerly known as BX wire, no idea why, but new stuff is called MC wire and generally has 3 wires in it in 110v residential applications, hot, neutral and ground.
Sheetrock removal is not a real big deal for adding a grounding wire. The whole panel doesn't have to come off, sections can be removed and returned and patched easily. It is a dust mess job . The walls will need to be repainted.
