Hello From Austin Texas

Discussion in 'New member introductions' started by Austin-T, Dec 1, 2021.

  1. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead

    Hello my name is Sal im from Austin Texas. I am brand new to Metal Casting. As in I've never done it before, never seen it, and know nothing about it but would like to learn.

    Any books and or other resources would would be greatly appreciated. Where do I get the tools and other misc. accessories etc.

    I am interested in learning how to cast Iron and Steel.

    I am not sure if I want to build my own waste oil furnace though I am capable of it. If they are available for purchase somewhere Id also consider it.

    I have been reading some posts on here about Electric Induction furnaces. I am really attracted to them but know very little about them and where to get one. My shop has 3 phase power with 1200 amps coming in.

    Id like the ability to cast at least 50Lbs. of metal at a time.

    If there is anybody located geographical close to me id like to meet you.

    Any help, comments, and feedback would be greatly appreciated.

    Thank you
    Sal
     
  2. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Welcome Sal,

    First off, for a first time caster and hobbyist, 50lbs of any metal is ambitious and especially so for iron, and even more so for steel. You might want to tell us a little more about your ambitions because if your interest is merely because you need a few castings, the amount of learning and invested time to succeed would be very large compared to sourcing. Besides melting and molten metal handling and management, there are molds, mold materials, casting process, safety......etc.....many things to master

    If your aim is a production environment, there are other mountains to climb including regulation.

    Just the same, we have members here casting metals in those amounts with the exception of steel. To my knowledge, we have one member that is melting steel near those levels, but not sure where he has gotten to as to actual steel castings.

    Melting 50lbs of iron with a fuel fired furnace is realistic and done here. IMO, it is not realistic for steel. But, since you have ample power, it is certainly within reach for induction melting but such a system will represent a significant financial investment.

    I'm sure others will offer their input.

    Best,
    Kelly
     
  3. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead

    Thank you for the welcome Kelly,

    So my interest at this point is strictly serious hobby. There are 2 things I would like to be able to cast and both are cast Iron. Frying Pans and Weights (for Gym and or Kettle balls). 45lbs is the heaviest in a standard set, so I thought 50 lbs capacity would be correct. Again, if cast iron is easier than I can do that. I just don't know where to get a supplier cast iron yet. Though I imagine a local scrap yard would be easy.

    The reason I said is steel is that I won my own Structural Steel Fabrication and Erection Company. I have scrap steel for ever and ever. I have a 20 yard recycling bin that the steel recycling company hauls off every 6-8 weeks. They dont give you much for it. I thought recycling it myself into something would be nice.

    As far a s a furnace of any sort it could be Propane, Waste oil, or Electrical (for an Induction Furnace). I have no access to natural gas.

    So if you think steel is out of the question then id be good with cast iron. I just dont know where to start as far as the furnace is concerned?

    Any more help would be appreciated.
    Sal
     
  4. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    Grey iron melts at 2100-2200F. Carbon steel, 2600-2800F. You need to pour at >300F higher than melt point. The furnace will have to be hotter than the pour temp. That makes steel a tall order for a fuel fired home foundry furnace. Now you may be able to dissolve steel in molten iron and add carbon as necessary. The iron practitioners here will need to comment on that. -It's a long way to go for a kettle bell, so you'd really need to get a charge out of the melting and casting process, but hey, such things happen here all the time in that respect.

    If you want to pour a 50lb part, you'll need additional metal for the feed system and for a shape like a kettle bell, maybe a lot more to prevent massive shrink defect.

    Best,
    Kelly
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021
  5. Petee716

    Petee716 Gold Banner Member

    Welcome Sal. Kelly has laid down some pretty solid info so far. There are some pretty sharp and experienced folks here, and a couple cross the steel threshold, but they are exceptions. It’s more than most hobby guys can manage for a number of reasons, but that’s for the individual to decide.
    I’ll let others more knowledgeable on the subject speak to your options with all of that power you have access to in terms of a furnace, but I’m personally a waste oil guy. I primarily cast aluminum, some bronze, and a couple times have poured cast iron. Other guys are the other way around ie iron>copper>aluminum. Waste oil (or any oil like diesel, kerosene, tranny fluid, etc) and a robust refractory-faced furnace gives that kind of versatility. Some guys melt only aluminum and use koawool with a satanite hot face coating and get along just fine with propane, but with the higher temperature stuff like copper alloys and cast iron, especially if burning oil, you really want a heavier hotface material like mizzou, kasto-lite30, or blu-ram refractory, probably insulated with koawool. My furnace is made from a beer keg with a 10” bore (I wish it was 12) with 1” mizzou hotface, backed up by 1-1/2” sand/fireclay mix. Yes, it’s uninsulated and takes awhile to heat up, but once it’s hot it does the job. If I were to do it again I would probably insulate it. But as it is, it’s pretty bulletproof. For more ideas on oil furnace builds check out threads by Tobho Mott, Melterskelter, oldironfarmer, and myfordboy (you’ll find his on YouTube).

    Buckle up. This is a helluva ride.

    Pete
     
  6. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    Welcome, Sal. The fact that you have 3-phase 1200 amp service means you have huge advantage over the rest of us. So, you could take advantage of a commercial induction furnace that will likely come up for sale somewhare in the Austin area. Induction and resistance heating offer many advantages compared to oil-fired melting. I'd love to have a decent-sized induction system, but make do with diesel for iron and a small ressitance kiln for aluminum as there is no way I'll come up with a power supply on a scale like you have.

    Steel melting does reportedly have its challenges. A couple visits to local steel foundries might help get you started though. Having steel for melting stock and for foundry fabrication plus all the fab equipment you likely have should also be very helpful. Many folks enter foundyry work having no knowledge of welding, machine shop work and having only a primitive shop. But, those that stay with it learn the necessary skills and acquire needed tools and get er done.

    Denis
     
  7. I would recommend going to https://www.afsinc.org/ You can find literature there. What are you trying to cast?
     
  8. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead

    Sorry for the delayed response-buys week.

    So I am on a commercial lot-close to 3 acres. Mostly concrete and dirt-nothing that can really catch on fire. I have a lot of space to play with.

    For now I can skip the kettle balls. Again, be nice to utilize my scrap, but if I cant I cant.

    I would still like to stay with the 50lb capacity.

    What I im not sure of is what kind to get or even build. Im stuck at if it should be propane, diesel, or an Induction furnace? Any thoughts on direction form folks would be helpful. If not an induction I could either build one or buy one. Again, not sure.

    Are waste oil or propane furnaces even sold that can melt iron?

    Again, any more help would be appreciated.

    Thanks
    Sal
    Thank you Pete!

    If I go in the "build it myself" direction this is extremely helpful.

    Any books you can recommend on building one?

    Thanks
    Sal
     
  9. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead


    Hi Denis, thank you for your response. So there are 2 foundries that do steel both are about 1.5 hours away. I have called both to ask if could come visit. They both said no. I guess its a competitive thing. I do know from pics on their website that they are both running several small electric induction furnaces.

    Thanks
    Sal
     
  10. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    My local steel foundry is not small. They have large Carbon Arc Furnaces.

    http://forums.thehomefoundry.org/index.php?threads/tour-of-sivyer-steel-castings.720/

    Sal, there are a lot of build threads here if you search the Furnaces and Their Construction sub forum. It's not hard to build a furnace. Same with burners, but like everything, takes some thougt and effort.

    Best,
    Kelly
     
  11. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead


    Kelly, I did get a chance to tour CMC steel Mill in Seguin TX. It had 2-3, 60 Ton electric Arc Furnaces. Each one had 3 electrodes much bigger and taller than my whole body. After each furnace was loaded with scrap, the graphite electrodes would slowly lower into place and start arcing as soon as they came into contact with the metal. It would melt 60 tons of metal in minutes. They had their own power plant that used factors of more electricity that the entire city ever used/produced.

    To this day the thing I remember most about the experience was the noise after the electrodes started arcing. Not only did I have on earplugs and ear muffs, the sound/vibrations seemed to shake my organs. It was quiet scary and unnerving.

    Ill do some digging through the sub forums.

    Thanks
    Sal
     
  12. Sal, I could get you a used induction melt system. The bad side is they are in demand and expensive, the good side is they don't lose their value. Did you try Texaloy in Floresville. They do iron, ni-hard, and steel. I sold them equipment when I liquidated Alamo Iron Works.
     
  13. metallab

    metallab Silver

    50 lbs (22kg) of steel ?
    Kelly Al2O3 already told you something that this requires a steep learning curve.

    Today I stumbled on a Youtube channel of a Chinese company https://www.cdocast.com/ which make nice induction furnaces. But a used induction system asl proposed by Eugene Eistein might be a good idea.
    Induction melting is the future. Very low energy consumption per kg of molten metal. For iron and steel fuel based furnaces are very inefficient and waste oil is polluting as well. Stinky and particulate matter belching cupola furnaces are a thing of the past.
     
  14. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    About the time someone challenges me concerning the "waste" of cleanly burning 5 gallons of diesel to make something of very long-lasting value that is not otherwise available from any other supplier, I ask them how many gallons of diesel they burned in the last week driving their obscenely over-sized 4-wheel-drive truck to the grocery store and to pick up the kids from school. That ususally results in a longish silence and a change of subject.

    Denis
     
  15. DavidF

    DavidF Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    About 40 gallons a week :D
     
    Petee716 likes this.
  16. Petee716

    Petee716 Gold Banner Member

    Me too. Just wait till I hang the plow on it!
     
    DavidF likes this.
  17. "Stinky and particulate matter belching cupola furnaces are a thing of the past"
    It is true about medium and small cupolas. The giant foundries still use cupolas.
    There is no cheaper way to melt 100 TPH even with all the pollution equipment.
     
  18. metallab

    metallab Silver

    I thought they are using EAF (arc furnaces) which is way more efficient. Those also belch a lot of PM but have pollution control to filter it out. Coal-based fuels are soon to be phased out for mainstream use otherwise we have a big problem in the 2030s or 2040s. Coal fired power stations are currently being phased out and probably blast furnaces are the next victims.

    OT: Did you already find a solution for your cast iron and steel melting ?
     
  19. I left out the word IRON. The biggest Iron Foundries still use cupolas! All the pipe mfgs like US Pipe, ACIPCO, McWane, Griffin as well as GM, Ford and Chrystler. They also use a secondary holding furnace. The large steel foundries all use electric arc melting. But many of the older large steel mills use a blast furnace. Not such a big deal on pollution from EAF. Just a correctly sized dust collector with high temperature bags...maybe even a spark arrestor before the dust collector. A cupola would have all that plus an afterburner, a wet scrubber, and a sludge ejector. And the sludge and where it ends up is another issue.
    I used to know it all or at the very least have had it all to sell dozens of times.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2021
    Meteor Monowatt likes this.
  20. Austin-T

    Austin-T Lead


    Hi Eugene, yes I would be open to used Induction furnaces. Just PM me and we can talk.

    I did try Texaloy. They were not fond of me coming to visit and talk.

    Sal
     

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