New to hobby, want to turn brass candle sticks into smaller shot

Discussion in 'General foundry chat' started by Jeremy Babb, Apr 20, 2023.

  1. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    New to the forums, and to the smelting/casting hobby so hello, and thanks for having me.

    Friday I am picking up an entire vacuum casting setup with bench top electric melting furnace and a paragon burn out furnace as well as a wax injector and vulcanizer setup. Super excited as I have been wanting to get into this for a while.
    I currently have 5 resin printers and a few filament. So have plenty of opportunity to either use "wax" resin or regular resin/filament and then make molds.

    That said, I have had for awhile a box full of old brass candle sticks. I took them all apart this evening and found the hollow ones (several are solid) are pretty full of old candle wax that seeped in over the years and filled them completely. I hit a few of them with a torch and melted/burned out the majority of the wax, I think I am going to try to just boil out the wax from the other ones in a large stainless pot.

    My question is......what should I do before trying to melt them in a propane forge or can they just go straight in and the wax will just burn away? I would like to melt them down and pour them into a barrel of water to end up with some rough shot that will be easier to deal with in the smaller bench top electric furnace.

    Also, side question.....all of them but two seem appropriately tarnished for there age. Two of them are super gloss bright gold, I am assuming there is some difference in the metal and also probably coated? Can they be melted down and mixed with the rest or should I use the metal from them separately?

    Just figured these would work well to use as I am learning since I already have them eliminating buying a bunch of metal to practice and learn with.

    Also looking for suggestions on maybe a amazon propane furnace to melt these down in? I do not foresee myself doing any large scale casting or a lot of large melts, so I'd just like to find something that will get these candle sticks melted down and then maybe the every great once in a while meltdown of other random stuff I may come across that won't fit in the small bench top electric one I am getting with all the vacuum casting stuff.
     

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  2. Hi Jeremy, those kind of brass items tend to be mass produced in places like Pakistan and India from mystery scrap and tend to have a pretty high zinc content, in fact they'd have as much zinc as humanly possible in some pieces and still end up yellow in colour. I find a good source of brass is old plumbing fittings, even if chrome plated. As far as converting the brass to shot, it's an extra step and you're melting the metal twice. If you've already got to the point of melting the metal and skimming off any crud and impurities it's far easier to pour it into a mould and have a finished casting. Those candlesticks would be good practice material but even with extra added copper from scrap wire it may not give a good result compared to brass scrap of known quality.
     
  3. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    I have a big box of old brass plumbing fittings also. The main reason I wanted to melt these down into shot was because the small electric bench top unit I am picking up is only a 3kg crucible so not nearly big enough for these candles sticks without cutting them into chunks which seems like more work than melting them down into shot. The castings I will be doing I should only need a handful of grams of metal at a time.
    I had really given any thought to the quality of the metal, and yes two of them still had little oval stickers on the bottom that said made in Pakistan. If nothing else it will just give me something to throw into the propane furnace to practice with I guess.
    I probably should use better quality materials when I start doing actual casting though, I don't want to start trying to learn and just be creating extra complications.
    Any suggestion on a place to purchase shot from to practice making some rings etc. I don't need anything fancy to begin with just a "cheap" shot that would be good to first start/practice with.

    Thank you for the insight though, much appreciated. I am 50 but feel all giddy like a kid before Christmas, anxious to make the drive tomorrow (6 hours round trip) to pick all this stuff up. I've watched countless hours of videos and tons in the last several months.
     
  4. Hi again Jeremy, after re-reading your initial post, the only thing needed to be done before melting in a propane furnace would be to cut up the pieces into crucible sized chunks with an angle grinder, making sure to clamp the items firmly with a vise before cutting so they can't move and break the cutting disc and cause an injury. The bright untarnished pieces may have been passivated which is a process to chemically establish a clear oxide coating on the metal to preserve the bright appearance at least until it gets sold.
     
  5. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    Mark, Thank you for the help and advice. I have a abrasive wheel chop saw to cut them up with. I think with the 10kg propane furnace I order today I should be able to just cut them in half and they will fit without being above the crucible.
    I know I have some high phosphor copper as well as some more standard copper and brass plumbing fittings I can throw a bit in when I melt down the candle sticks. Once I get a better feel for all the processes I'll probably buy some proper casting metal.
    Plan to start with simple band type rings etc, nothing to complicated to put on sprues. Thankfully the stuff I am picking up includes a foredom wax carving iron and a grobet wax pot and multiple boxes full of sprues and related wax stuff. I basically walked into a complete jewelry casting and mold making setup for dirt cheap. I'll try and calm my excitement enough to take and post some pictures once I get back tomorrow :)
    I'm sure I will have some more questions as I start really getting into this. Very glad I found a friendly community to become a part of.
     
    Tobho Mott and Mark's castings like this.
  6. Al2O3

    Al2O3 Administrator Staff Member Banner Member

    You are probably aware, but as the zinc content increases it becomes much easier to cook it off. Besides converting the melt into the white/yellow fluff of Zinc Oxide, the vapor can make you nauseous. Even though you'll be melting relatively small amounts just be aware and make sure it is well ventlated.

    Best,
    Kelly
     
  7. mytwhyt

    mytwhyt Silver

  8. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    It is similar to that one yes, the one I just got home with I think is a vevor unit. I am also waiting on amazon to deliver the propane one I ordered, it should be here tomorrow, they delivered the refactory cement I ordered today as well as a bottle of casting resin for my 3d printer from siraya tech.
    I'll posy pics of everything I picked up today in a couple hours once I get it all into the shop and on a table.
    The propane furnace coming tomorrow is this one:
    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09HZGZP54
     
  9. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    I am hoping a good amount of it will cook off in the propane one that will be run outside. The smaller one will be used with a ventilation system I built a few years back for exhausting my large Co2 laser. I plan on making a booth that will house both the smaller melting furnace and the wax burnout kiln with both a top and back exhaust so I should have plenty of positive airflow moving into the booth and then vented outside.
     
  10. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    Deleted full images, attached as thumbnails in following reply.....sorry
     

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    Last edited: Apr 21, 2023
  11. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    Here is everything I got. I think I did pretty good for $1200

    20230421_175107.jpg 20230421_175054.jpg 20230421_175103.jpg 20230421_175123.jpg 20230421_175127.jpg 20230421_175131.jpg 20230421_175141.jpg
     
    Tobho Mott and Petee716 like this.
  12. mytwhyt

    mytwhyt Silver

    deleted
     
  13. mytwhyt

    mytwhyt Silver

    Don't know why my text is being deleted every time I preview The link I included is left, but the text is gone. Hoping the third time will work..

    That was a good find and a great price. Interested to see how the Vevor furnace works. I want to do some copper rings. I was thinking the carbon crucible would cut down on the O2 being absorbed. Looking forward to helping any way I can.. You're off to a good start I wont preview this time, Now I've lost the link.
     
  14. mytwhyt

    mytwhyt Silver

  15. mytwhyt

    mytwhyt Silver

    deleted again
     
  16. Jeremy Babb

    Jeremy Babb Copper

    yeah it did strange things when I first tried to post the pictures
     

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