BEARDSLEY & PIPER MULBARO MULLER

Discussion in 'Sand Mullers' started by Planebuilder, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. Planebuilder

    Planebuilder Copper

    Do any of you know anything about the B&P Mulbaro Mullers? I was going to start building a muller, I like building stuff, but it always takes longer than planed, and so I looked for a used one to rebuild. These "Mulbaros" started popping up, they must have been successful there are lots of them out there. It looks like you lift the top section up with a hoist, load sand, lower it and Mull. When done, lift again and roll the bottom like a wheelbarrow to where you need it. bp-mulbaro-muller.jpg
     
  2. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    I knew the owner of a local bronze casting business who used a Mulbaro muller. It was a capable muller that I had a chance to buy when he retired. The main reason I passed is that it would have taken up a lot of room in my foundry, but it would have been sweet to mull very large batches of sand. I was tempted. But, I had made a decent muller from an old Red Lion ( a Canadian brand I believe) cement mixer and it is working very well.

    http://forums.thehomefoundry.org/index.php?threads/another-cement-mixer-muller.286/

    Should you elect to build, I would endorse the Red Lion as it is more ruggedly built than common box-store mixers with a cast iron ring gear and drive gear, enclosed chain drive, heavy support bearing for the tub, and a tub fabricated from heavy sheet metal. I have used it for hundreds of hours and it has been trouble free. I recently removed the original half horse motor and replaced it with a one horse so I could mull a completely full tub (60 pounds) of sand per batch. The half horse would do it, but it also would bog down every once in a while. The one horse plows on unperturbed. I experimented briefly with a chute to aid in dumping the muller into a bucket, but have learned to just dump into a couple 16x20“ plastic photography lab trays. That works well enough that I have not bothered to make the chute, yet.

    Denis
     
  3. Planebuilder

    Planebuilder Copper

    Thanks for the info Denis. I agree the older mixers will outlast the newer ones, and are available on Kijiji, I bought one for cement for $100.
    Your build is making me think it could be the way to go.
     
  4. HT1

    HT1 Gold Banner Member

    used one in the Navy,
    it MUST to be placed under a chian fall or hoist to lift the top off so you an use the Barrow,
    it has Rubber muller wheels which is fine if they are in good condition,

    I would be all but positive it is 3 Phase , and it will suck some serious juice ,



    V/r HT1
     
  5. Planebuilder

    Planebuilder Copper

    HT1, I assumed it would be 3 PH and would change motors. But thanks for the heads up on the rubber wheels! I have seen that a lot of the commercial mullers use rubber wheels, but I would prefer steel, with the age of these machines the rubber is probably getting ripe.
     
  6. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    If it is 5 HP or less you could just get a VFD and keep the motor. I think 5hp is about the max for single phase 230V input. I run 3 VFD’s in my shop and love em.

    If the rubber were bad on the wheels, it would not surprise me if solid tires for a forklift wheel could be found that would fit. Takes a special heavy duty press to press new tires on, but is commonly done by the tire sellers. They have the presses on a truck and come to you.

    Denis
     
  7. Planebuilder

    Planebuilder Copper

    I should look into the VFD's, are they good at high load starts? I have one on a mill head on a CNC machine, but it doesn't have to work that hard, nice speed control though. I run a few machines (lathes, mills) with homemade rotophase converters, but they are not good for high power start ups like with a compressor, I just assumed a Muller would be a "hard" start against a pile of sand, but maybe with the gearing it's not that bad? With the Lathe & Mills the motor starts with no load, then a cluch engages the power when wanted, I guess I could do the same with a Muller.
    I have seen new tires for sale for mullers, but we are casters, I could replace old rubber with aluminum!
     
  8. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member


    First, let me say I am not a VFD expert by any means though I do use them and have read some about them.

    One great thing about VFD’s is that they do not usually “slam” on and off. They are all programmable with a ramp up and ramp down rate that the user selects. So, they can start well under load and are very commonly used on heavy equipment like conveyor belts. So, though I have no personal experience with such applications, I can infer from that that they do start well under load.

    I would also put a plug in for a US-based company that stocks and sells VFD’s manufactured offshore. The company distinguishes itself by providing technical service promptly (usually I get put right through) by a tech who actually knows the product well and speaks English as a first language as compared to some fellow 10 time zones away painfully trying to read out of a service manual. So, give AutomationDirect a call if you get interested in a VFD. You might pay 10% more than you would for a poorly documented VFD on eBay. But, as a non-expert, the service and the fact that they actually replaced a defective unit immediately for me is worth the difference. I did get a bad unit from them and they shipped that same day a replacement on the promise that I would return, at their cost, the defective unit.

    Funny you mentioned casting tires—-the same thought occurred to me.
    .

    Denis
     
    Planebuilder likes this.
  9. Planebuilder

    Planebuilder Copper

    Thanks for the info, I will look into Automation Direct.
     
  10. Jason

    Jason Gold

    Automation direct is expensive! Price out on Amazon and banggood. It's all the same stuff made in China. You get less support buying this way, but there is enough brain power around here, you don't need "Bob" at some shitty tech department asking if the dot is white or pink.:rolleyes:

    My tech department is Matt and tops all of them! My VFD for my 3hp lathe was 80bucks! 5hp is not the limit for VFD's either, I've seen them offered for 7hp. And it's NOT 10% Denis, My VFD was $377 at automation direct. I'll take my poorly documented discount vfd's any day! Funny how the LITERATURE found online for the overpriced VFD's worked exactly for my cheapies. Why is that? Under the cover, it's still the SAME VFD.:rolleyes:
     
  11. Jason

    Jason Gold

  12. rocco

    rocco Silver

  13. Jason

    Jason Gold

    lol... Yeah just a bit. :D I'm stuck doing the dryer plug thing at the moment between my 2 vfds. I need some way to throw a switch to flip from one to the other instead of digging behind the air compressor.:(
     
  14. Mister ED

    Mister ED Silver

    Bangood schmangood ... I've been waiting 11 weeks for for some cheap arse carbide inserts to arrive. They have not moved in tracking since May 6. Whenever I bitch to their customer service ... Oh maybe there is a holiday in a country, maybe they are held in customs, maybe they are delayed for bad weather, maybe they are blah, blah, blah. Never again, I will pay a few more bucks and get the crap I order in my grubby paws in a reasonable amount of time.

    You can save some bucks with cheap import VFDs, but I've been burned too. I bought one and the stupid thing did not support a 3-wire control. And documentation generally sucks ... sometimes its not worth it.

    If you watch and shop, you can sometimes find used 1ph input vfds on FleaBay. I picked up a very nice Allen Bradley PowerFlex for $75 or so (2 or 3hp, cant remember).
     
  15. Jason

    Jason Gold

  16. Mister ED

    Mister ED Silver

    Why am I not surprised this is the VFD you have :p (copied from Jason's link):
    "Variable Frequency Drive, MYSWEETY VFD Inverter Frequency Converter 2.2KW 3HP 220V 12A for Spindle Motor Speed Control"

    Here is how I shop for a VFD, I download the documentation. Look up the set up that I need and see if it tells me how to set it up (diagrams of specific set up are even better). The VFD with the clearest instructions for my specific needs is the winner.
     
  17. Jason

    Jason Gold

    I don't care if the thing is hot pink! I just need it to work and be cheap. I keep losing the TV remote in the garage so my wife bought me a hot pink one! Figured it would be hard to lose it in the clutter. Too bad it didn't work for my tv. Just like flashlights, I'll never buy a black maglite ever again. Bright silver for me.
     
  18. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Gold Banner Member

    Yes, there are very large VFD’s available for much greater than 5hp. The kicker is that for (I’ll say it again) 230V single phase input, 5hp is as large as I have seen. Could be bigger ones, I’d be interested to know.

    I too have purchased a cheap VFD. But it was cheap in dollars and cents only. The documentation on the cheapies is usually either non-existent or written in less than clear English. Hooking up the control switches, potentiometers, dust-proof enclosure, remote cabling took a day and a half. Works fine now. But I’d have much rather gotten the AD unit with spiral bound very well written documentation, and clear answers to questions about suitability for purpose from the techs. For cheap units accessories (like a keypad or remote keypad) may or may not be available and good luck if you have questions or a defective item.

    If the OP’s primary concern is lowest possible price, then, by all means spend some time shopping for the cheapest available. It’s whatever is top priority.

    Denis

    Added: I did not comment on setup time using an AD VFD with remote keypad—-Realistically about 45 mins stripping wire ends and connecting the input 220 single phase to the drive unit and also connecting the motor cable to the unit. Follow the 1-2-3... steps to set motor amperage, rpm, ramp up and down as clearly laid out. Push the button. Good to go. Then a little more time physically securing the drive unit, cleaning up the cables with strain relief and and clamps.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2020
  19. HT1

    HT1 Gold Banner Member

    the mullers wheels where narrow compared to a forklift, about 2.5 inches wide if I remember well
     
  20. rocco

    rocco Silver

    If the wheels need to be recovered and a suitable pre-made wheel is not available, would something like a high durometer castable polyurethane work?
     
    Melterskelter likes this.

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