I just came inside to share my first LFC experience. Im using a Vevor 8Kg propane furnace and it works so well. I poured at 700C using my new digital K-type unit. As you can see, the aluminum didn't quite make all the way down.But close. The rest of the casting is perfect aside from that. The funny knob on the backside is a knuckle, a separate part. Now to figure out what I did wrong. I put the tin pan on a slight downward angle to match the filler. I liked how well the compound help up and flaked off nicely. There was hardly any smoke or flame at all, like none. The melt took 10 minutes itself. Pretty fast. Maybe that is an issue. Not sure.
The melt was too cold. Pour hotter. I typically pour at 1375F (~750C) but, the time from when the crucible leaves the furnace to when I pour is typically <10 seconds, and, my pouring cups are insulating material and take very little heat so I can use lower melt temps and my pour temps are very nearly what I measure. During your process, if you take the temp, skim, remove the crucible from the furnace with tongs, transfer it to a shank, then pour, there is heat loss. When you pour into a cold metalic cup, it further reduces heat and yours looks nice but perhaps a little massive. So even though you may have measured 700c, by the time you pour and it heads down the sprue, it might be considerably cooler. Successful pours are motivating. Minimize the opportunity for heat loss and pour at 760-780c. Smaller masses of metal lose heat faster. Melt more metal than you need and fill the pouring cup rapidly full and keep it that way. If you get complete castings you can further refine your melt and pouring process. Best, Kelly
Not bad for your first pour. Kick up the heat. +1 for melting a full pot of metal. I do 80% full no matter the size of the pattern. Oohhh, coat that naked wool.
Thanks Kelly, I was thinking last night, that the temp was the bigger issue. Also the loaf pan I used likely didn't help either. Before I do any changes I'll start by higher temps and different pouring cup. We just don't have foam cups here so maybe I'll do the open can method this time. Thanks.
Thanks man, Yes it was good practice. I did coat the wool with 2 layers of refactory cement. I will likely add more. This is the third time I've used the furnace. Cheers,William
The positive thing about a soup can besides being free and easy is they are typically pretty light gauge so not very massive and rob less heat. Square is better than round for the reasons mentioned, but that said, I used straight sections of muffler pipe for the first 2-3 years I was lost foam casting with success, which by comparison to a soup can are pretty massive, but would still get occasional defects even when I seemingly did everything identical to defect-free pours. Though I had refined other processes too, when I started using the insulated offset cups, defects became quite rare and first pass success nearly 100%. I was pleasantly surprised by that. It's been 6 years now since I made my first insulated reusable cup, but if casting is something you will routinely do, you may eventually want to invest in making something like: Reuasbale Offset Pouring Basin | The Home Foundry The easiest way to fabricate one is gluing fiber board together. In the meantime, you should be able to be successful using a metalic cup and higher pour temp. Best, Kelly
Thanks Kelly, I think I can take a can and reform it into a more square shape. Thats step one, then higher temps. I have watched your video on reusable cup so I'll revisit that too. It will only get better from here. Is it your thought that I don't need to add more mass to the bottom of the part? Cheers, William
So I went back at it and just came in. I removed that other part to aide in flow and it made a difference. The aluminum made it to the bottom and only have minor defects. I think this will work for future pours. I pulled the crucible out and measured 750, so the pour was likely closer to 700. U sed the can method and it went awesome. There is alot of meat to machine so hopefully the bad areas are removed. I'll test it with a Dremel and see how deep it is.
So this defect is the classic lost foam fold defect. It appears at the bottom of your casting because it is the very first metal into your cup that starts melting foam. The initial contact of molten metal with foam creates some turbulence and trapped oxides and that dirty metal travels down through the pattern and presents itself in the bottom of the casting since it was the first metal in. In my early days this is exactly what I battled from time to time with round cups and pouring directly onto the sprue. So my remedy was to give that initial dirty metal a place to go somewhere other than my casting by adding a feature like this to the feed system, doing something like this: That worked pretty well, but not nearly as well as pouring beside the sprue in an offset cup. By the way, what's this feature? If you poured a little hotter you might still get there. One thing about lost foam; pouring hot means you get a complete casting although it may have some minor (micro) porosity. Pouring too cold means you get to try again.... Best, Kelly
Morning Kelly, Great suggestions. I will add length to that centre sprue. I want to pour a couple more too. That "feature" is where the tremelo will attach at the butt of the guitar body. it just sits on the edge, being a flat top body I wanted a simple mounting with no holes showing on the top. Are you saying, not to pour right on the sprue? I'll definitely pour even hotter, closer to 780C so the drop in temp is still desirable. Question: is the size of my sprues 3/4"x3/4" sufficient, or should the centre sprue be 1"x1"? I am truly loving this process, I have never done green sand but this feels cleaner and faster. This last pour I hardly got that initial burst of smoke and fire. I have the part mounted up on my cnc, I will see how it looks. the folds are not deep and I have almost 1/8" of material to machine out of the thickness and the dims are almost dead on, so very minimal shrinkage if any. Moving forward, I want to see if I can make the part as smooth as I can so that there may not be a need to cnc the final piece but just polish it up. Thanks for all your support and advise. If I get really good at this, my goal is to offer them to the public. Cheers, William
Yes. When you pour on the sprue, the metal tends to penetrates it in an uneven chaotic manner. The sides melt and fall into the stream and either buoyantly float, ignite, expand, etc or travel into the pattern with the molten metal. When you pour beside the sprue in an offset cup with a weir, the sprue tends to become more completely and uniformly covered by a pool of molten metal which is more likely to consume the sprue in more uniform plug flow. In lost foam there will be a liquid and gas boundary layer between the solid foam and metal front. The gas and liquid to a lesser degree is what is expelled to the mold media as the pattern is consumed. For a small part like that 3/4 should be fine but you might benefit from a little more sprue length (maybe 6" total length from cup to pattern). More sprue height means more metal pressure which helps expel the evaporated foam through the coating to the mold media. This is a very good thing. Many people allow the sprue to protrude above the sand and that just becomes fuel to burn in the cup. You know you have good pouring technique and a good feed system when you have no flame smoke. When I started using the offset pouring cups, this became much more routine. You might even go 800C. It's sort of hard to say how much heat you are losing and what your actual/net effective pouring temp is without seeing your routine, and as I mentioned, smaller melts lose heat fast (what size crucible are you using?), so melt a larger amount of metal and pour the excess into an ingot tray. If you video your pour from the time you take the metal temp to the time you complete the pour, there is usually a lot of useful information and pointers that can observed and offered. Best, Kelly
Wonderful advice Kelly, That graphic was helpful, when I post on Facebook forums most say to add vents and more runners and gates. But I know better, now that I've done two pours. "Proof is in the pour" I will definitely make the changes and video my setup and process next time I pour. As I research InsWool I am wondering what other materials I could use to make a cup. I know you mention fibre board. Thats a bigger investment than I want to make at this point. Thanks again, Will
There's a lot of old not so great info out there about how to do lost foam casting hobbyist style that comes from ancient Instructables articles and such, written by people who were figuring things out on their own with much fewer online resources available at the time than we have now. Parts got made, but they weren't always pretty. Some of the stuff about venting and using thicker coatings comes from those old articles, I have no doubt. The much thicker coats of drywall mud many hobbyists were using back then likely made venting a much bigger problem to solve than with the thin coatings we now know about. Jeff
The cost of these materials is 2x-3x what they were two years ago. Sign of the times I guess. I cant be without them. You can buy ~24 x 12 x 1/2" ceramic board for about $40 delivered on Amazon. Probably similar on eBay. You want 2300F rated board. I think you could make 3 cups from that. Although I've patched and repaired them a number of times, I've been using the ones I made from moldable ceramic fiber for 5 years now. Just like other foundry equipment it's an investment. But, you also need glue. Some have used sodium silicate or mortar, but the ceramic fiber is much better because like the fiber board, it is unwetted by aluminum and you can wipe fillets into corners of your cup for easy release of the residual aluminum and also to have some on hand for touch ups and repairs. Here's a source. The smallest quanity in tube form is $25. Ceramic Fiberboard Moldable Mix | 2300℉ | In Stock - CeraMaterials I think you could use some very light gauge metal (like roof flashing from big box stores), bend it into a four-sided cup open on top and bottom, and tape the corner to keep the sand from leaking in. The tape will of course fail when you pour but the surrounding sand will hold it in place. Could also just take a round can and press the four flat sides. Put the sprue at one end and pour in the other. Best, Kelly
Thanks again Kelly, I'll look into it for sure. Until then I'll source a square can. I was able to do a bit of machining. I did a couple passes of the rough and a single final pass. I will do one more then flip it and true up the bottom. Definitely will need to do some die grinding in those tight areas. You can see from the closeup the slight pitting. I should be able to machine it out. That was the first pass. I have to say I am happy, and the bad ares dissappeared right away so they weren't deep at all. I still have lot's of meat yet as well.
Now that I have done a couple pours, my next goal is to really fine-tune the foam pattern to the degree that no machining is necessary. Seeing how my first two pours went I have a better understanding of the process and that the thinned compound I used as the shell coating was good and not too thick. With the recommendations from Kelly on longer sprue and higher temps, I am sure the next pours will be awesome.
I've made three pouring cups from materials on hand. First one was sand mixed with epoxy used for stone work and coated with Satanite. It worked but cracked every use. I would just patch the cracks with more Satanite. Second one was Kaowool soaked in Satanite and formed in a square bowl, heated to cure and then coated with more Satanite. Then made a lifting cradle like Kelly mentioned. Third one I used a 4" electric junction box, drilled a hole near the corner, lined with wool and coated with the Satanite. This one works the best for me. Satanite is non-wetting so it comes clean after each use.
You're using your CNC router right with a ball end mill? No coolant/cutting fluid I presume? Are you seeing any loading of the bit? What alloy is your casting stock? Sometimes organic shapes can be difficult to mount/clamp for machining and adding a couple of features (which can potentially be removed) to the pattern/casting can be a great help. Pouring technique and feed system can go a long ways to eliminating those fine defects but casting stock melt management is also important. A very lean burner tune, and not overpowering the melt with more burner flow than needed (at least as/after the metal begins to melt, and minimizing the exposure time after melt has occurred, all can help reduce H2 porosity. Degassing can become necessary depending. It can do more harm than good if not done properly. Lower density foams are best for LF casting but the density of the foam can affect how well the pattern machines and finishes. The colored insulation board at the big box stores is typically 1.3-1.5lbs/ft3 which is a good compromise of these two needs. It is extruded polystyrene (XPS) that has fine cell structure as opposed to the white expanded polystyrene (EPS) which has bonding lines between the expanded beads. When sanded, XPS surface finish can be improved up to 320 grit but I usually start and end with 220grit. You can even polish is a bit with paste wax but make sure the solvent in your paste wax doesn't attack the foam. Best, Kelly