Brunhilda's Bra (Or my idea of a pouring funnel)

Discussion in 'Foundry tools and flasks' started by Melterskelter, Jun 2, 2018.

  1. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    I have found that accurately solo pouring the first few pounds of iron from a very full A20 crucible using a trolley to be challenging. 3/4 of the time I spill very little, but some times 2 or 3 pounds ends up dribbling off the mold. (Sometimes the results are hilarious as recently shown photos of a cast iron "mouse" demonstrated.) Most of the time I can take the easy way out and just fill my crucible to 3/4 and still pour the patterns I am doing. In the near future I will be pouring a pattern that will take about 55 pounds of metal. So, there will be little room for sloppiness and maximal tendency to slop given the full crucible.

    So, I have probably reinvented a long-ago-devised wheel, well funnel really. It will consist of an armature of bent and silver soldered 3/32" (editted from my initial report of 1/16---ooops)tig filler rod and some legs of scrap 1/2" square bar. The legs have reinforcing struts tigged to the base of the armature.

    Then I am going to form a cone liner of kaowool soaked in diluted sodium silicate. I doubt heat will transmit enough during the very short pour interval to break the 1200 deg silver solder joints. I think it has enough mass and is broad enough to have adequate stability. Time will tell on both of those points.

    I will be using the large plastic funnel shown in one of the photos to form the inside of the kaowool funnel.

    Are there other proven solutions out there for the guy pouring solo? I thought of a simple cone-shaped riser liner to be simply set on the mold, but was concerned it might tend to float if the least metal got under it while pouring and it might tip easily.

    PouringFunnel (5).JPG PouringFunnel (4).JPG PouringFunnel (3).JPG PouringFunnel (2).JPG PouringFunnel (6).JPG
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2018
  2. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    55lbs? That's a lot of iron. Whatcha pouring? Are you going to film it for us?

    The silver soldier gives me the creeps on that skinny 1/16" tig rod, but you've got a dozen soldiered connections there. I bet that's enough.
    If they all let go, you still have the roundness of the shape to hopefully hold the bra together. I would have tigged some 3/32" or 1/8" wire, but I'm a chicken shit and
    like my bras with plenty of underwire support. "Lift and separate!" Why am I suddenly remembering the Otto Titsling from beaches? Thanks! I and hate Bette Midler. :rolleyes:
  3. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

  4. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Arrrrgh, it was 3/32 wire. My bad for saying 1/16. I corrected my initial post on that point. That 3/32 does seem stiff enough to me. I doubt the soldered joints will heat up very much if at all as there will be a half inch of kaowool between them and the iron which will be pouring for 15 to thirty seconds I would guess with the stream playing off different interior surfaces during that time. If one or more pop, I'll redo it with tig connections. And I agree that if only one or two pop, Brunhilda should not have a total "costume malfunction" as the kao shell will have quite a bit of strength---I hope.

    I'll be casting a 48" version of the 36" straight edge I have shown on other threads.
  5. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    No worries. Madonna would be proud to wear that thing! Here's to hoping you film it for us. I'll never get to pour iron, but find it fascinating you guys do it in your backyard.;)
  6. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Progress report:
    I did "glass" the kaowool with a mix of plain "RU" sodium silicate diluted 1 part SS to 5 parts water. (I have no idea if this is an ideal mix and suspect that it could be diluted a fair bit more and still nicely stiffen and harden the kaowool) I simply took a piece of the wool and poured the SS mix over it on a cookie sheet and then mopped the wool and balled it up to drive the SS into it and saturate it. Then I formed it into the armature and more or less pressed it into place using the large funnel. I then baked that assembly in the oven at 250 (again a WAG) for maybe 5 hours until it was hard to touch. It took that long to seem to be dry. Here is how it looked at that point. There are some pretty large wrinkles as I was not very careful about cutting the wool to "cone" shape but just laid it into the armature. (Next time I will be more careful) PouringFunnel (13).JPG
    It would have been plenty strong to withstand pour stresses at that point, but I remember admonitions to avoid needless turbulence of the poured metal stream so I decided to fair the surface using fumed silica also called "colloidal" silica mixed with SS. I again used 1:5 diluted SS not knowing if this is the optimal mix---unlikely as it was chosen out of the air. Here is how it looked after that. PouringFunnel (9).JPG

    After baking the funnel again the kaowool liner was shiny and rock hard but did have 15 or so pock marks where I think the fumed silica contracted on drying. At that point I really do think it would have worked fine, but it is so easy to mix up the silica that I just mixed up a tablespoon or so with SS and filled the pocks and recooked it.
    Here is what the mixed silica and SS looks like. It has the consistency of good raspberry jam without the seeds. PouringFunnel (7).JPG

    Anyway, this funnel feels very rigid just like it was a "thrown" pot of ceramic clay. It has a similar heft so that with the combined weight of the armature, wool, and SS it feels like it will be quite stable.

    The weather is not favoring a melt today, but I am anxious to try it and a new pattern out. So, we shall see....
  7. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    C7DF207F-02E7-453C-AD60-68B4DE2DE559.jpeg 85E8230B-5609-46F4-9CF8-6BFB6DFB687B.jpeg

    Final note: the kao/SS cuts easily with a hacksaw. I wanted an inch or so gap between the bottom of the funnel and the sprue opening to make it possible to monitor the sprue while pouring. Next is as trial by fire.
  8. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    Film it for us!

    The chick has always grossed me out. Must be her eyebrows.
  9. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Well, Brunhilda can take the heat. I did try it out today on a fairly small melt---12 pounds on a cored prism pattern I am working on. Sorry, no video as I have not taken the time to set for that. But that funnel allowed me to pour very fast and hit the sprue without spilling or slopping a drop. I like that.

    The combo of the SS and kaowool held up just fine, though I did note where the iron poured on the lining there was a little powdering of the SS glaze on the wool. If anyone is aware of a better liner to use, please speak up. There was essentially no heat transfer to the wire armature. I touched the wires immediately after the pour and they were barely even warm. So, I think a person can use any joining method desired for the armature without fear of failure. The funnel was very stable and showed no tendency to move, tilt, or displace. I anticipate using it routinely in the future. There also was no adherent iron on the inside of the funnel after pouring.

    I will try to get someone to video my next 50 pound pour. Usually I am alone---good for concentration but bad for videoing.

    I will have more to say about the, to me, interesting cored prism project I am working on once I have a few things refined a bit. This core business is pretty virgin territory for me and, naturally, the core and pattern are a bit more challenging than a simple gear or wheel. So, there are plenty of "learning opportunities." Encouraging results to date though....
  10. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    Sounds like it worked great! I tried having my wife do some video work. It didn't work out too well. I video all my own stuff by myself. That's the one cool thing with the gopro6, you can talk to it and it does it. Unlike my..... NOT GOING THERE!:eek:
  11. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Ooooohhh, I see. I thought that WAS your wife pictured a couple posts up. ;-)
  12. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    lmao... I'm glad my wife doesn't grab her crotch in public.:eek:;)
  13. FishbonzWV

    FishbonzWV Copper Banner Member

    If anyone is aware of a better liner to use, please speak up.

    Try painting a layer or two of Satanite on it. You could cure it by inverting the funnel over your vent hole when you fire up the furnace.
  14. Tobho Mott

    Tobho Mott Silver Banner Member

    I can see how it would be tricky to avoid spills when pouring a very full crucible from a trolley. Cool solution!

  15. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Thanks, Fishbonz. Sounds like a good idea. I have been curious about satanite since I have seen folks mentioning it here as included in their various furnace projects. I have also been curious as to whether painting it on the interior of my oil-fired furnace might improve performance. I'll order some today. Any favorite sources of supply?
  16. FishbonzWV

    FishbonzWV Copper Banner Member

    I get mine from here.

    If you haven't seen my vid on applying

    I used about 11 to 12 pounds on my furnace, building up to about 1/4" thick on the sides and thicker on the floor.
    For just coating your funnel, one pound will do but shipping two pounds is the same rate.
  17. Petee716

    Petee716 Silver Banner Member

    Paste Barbara Eden's face on there and you'd have something!

    I'm glad to see the funnel worked out well. I had been wondering about residue after the pour. It looks like it won't be an issue at all.

    Jason likes this.
  18. Melterskelter

    Melterskelter Silver Banner Member

    Thanks, Fishbonz. Great video and helpful info.

    No, Pete, no trouble with residue in the funnel. And, I think the funnel will hold up to many pours based on what I am seeing. Still, if there is a proven liner material, I want to try it.

    Also, with respect to my comment above about Satanite and efficiency of my furnace, I think I may have been confusing the Satanite with ITC100. Is the consensus that ITC is helpful with improving efficiency or not so much?
  19. Jason

    Jason Silver Banner Member

    Remember her on the Andy Griffith show? She was so hot, she made cast iron look cold.


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